Wed Sep 29 23:21:58 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:how do i deal with my daughter being VERY RUDE
Wed Sep 29 23:22:03 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:verbally
Wed Sep 29 23:22:10 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:How old is she?
Wed Sep 29 23:22:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she'll be 4 on nov 4
Wed Sep 29 23:22:41 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tell me some of the things she is saying that you consider
to be rude.
Wed Sep 29 23:22:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she shouts at us in a very rude way and will deliberately
say things to hurt feelings
Wed Sep 29 23:23:08 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well there's "NO!!!" in an extremely nasty tone when we are
asking her a question
Wed Sep 29 23:23:25 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its not really the word so much...its the tone
Wed Sep 29 23:23:29 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its really really nasty
Wed Sep 29 23:23:54 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and if she's talking to, say, me....and someone else like
my husband or mom replies....
Wed Sep 29 23:23:58 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:When she is saying "no", was it a "yes or no" ? that you
asked her?
Wed Sep 29 23:24:16 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she will snap VERY LOUDLY and NASTILY "i am talking to
MOMMY!!!!!"
Wed Sep 29 23:24:29 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes it is a yes/no question for that case
Wed Sep 29 23:24:43 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Does she have any siblings?
Wed Sep 29 23:24:46 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i do talk to her about the appropriate way to respond
Wed Sep 29 23:24:54 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:no.....her brother died at birth in april
Wed Sep 29 23:25:03 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:That's right, I remember now.
Wed Sep 29 23:25:23 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Are you familiar with the mistaken goal chart?
Wed Sep 29 23:25:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i tell her that its ok to say no and its ok to want to talk
to me....but she needs to say it in a kind way, not a rude way
Wed Sep 29 23:25:46 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and i even model it for her
Wed Sep 29 23:26:04 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i have heard you talk about it here...refresh my memory
though because its not engrained yet
Wed Sep 29 23:26:17 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:What happens after you tell her the info?
Wed Sep 29 23:26:30 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh she just sits there sullenly and sometimes she snaps
more
Wed Sep 29 23:26:44 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she is one who will NOT do what you want her to do if you
ask her just because you asked her
Wed Sep 29 23:26:59 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Okay. Choose one of the catagories below that best
describes how YOU feel when she is doing this (being rude.)
Wed Sep 29 23:27:05 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she's very stubborn and tends to go opposite of what you
want just because you want it...when she's in that mood, which is
often
Wed Sep 29 23:27:13 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:annoyed, worried, guilty?
Wed Sep 29 23:27:18 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:annoyed
Wed Sep 29 23:27:24 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:threatned, challenged, provoked?
Wed Sep 29 23:27:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:pissed off is more like it, lol
Wed Sep 29 23:27:37 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:hurt, disbelieving, disappointed?
Wed Sep 29 23:27:50 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:one out of all those or one from each group of three
Wed Sep 29 23:27:52 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:?
Wed Sep 29 23:27:55 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:hopeless, helpless, like giving up?
Wed Sep 29 23:28:12 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Annoyed, worried, guilty is the first group
Wed Sep 29 23:28:23 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:So choose one group.
Wed Sep 29 23:28:29 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh i see
Wed Sep 29 23:28:33 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:ummm
Wed Sep 29 23:28:53 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i guess the first one
Wed Sep 29 23:29:00 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:it makes me very mad
Wed Sep 29 23:29:27 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but i do tend to feel guilty a lot too cuz i feel like i
should be doing better so that she won't act this way
Wed Sep 29 23:29:28 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:So annoyed, worried ,guilty OR threatened, challenged,
provoked?
Wed Sep 29 23:29:37 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:And you can just choose one of the words too.
Wed Sep 29 23:29:52 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:annoyed more than anything
Wed Sep 29 23:30:22 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:If your feelings are ones in the first catagory, then that
tells us that her mistaken goal is probably undue attention.
Wed Sep 29 23:30:30 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:no doubt
Wed Sep 29 23:30:38 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:That doesn't mean that you aren't giving her enough
attention.
Wed Sep 29 23:30:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:that doesn't surprise me at all
Wed Sep 29 23:30:54 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Children want to belong in their world.
Wed Sep 29 23:31:04 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:They get certain ideas about how to belong.
Wed Sep 29 23:31:09 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Some of their ideas are mistaken ideas.
Wed Sep 29 23:31:37 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:So a child might mistakenly believe that in order to
"belong" at home, they need to be getting attention most all the
time.
Wed Sep 29 23:31:58 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:that would be true of maeven because she won't even let
adam and i have a conversation...
Wed Sep 29 23:32:03 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:phone calls are a nightmare too
Wed Sep 29 23:32:19 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:It isn't true that the child needs to have attention all of
the time to belong, but most of us can understand how children DO
form these mistaken ideas.
Wed Sep 29 23:33:35 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Our job as parents it so help children learn to belong and
feel significant by helping them to contribute in meaninful ways
--to feel that they are genuinely needed at home.
Wed Sep 29 23:33:48 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:hmmm
Wed Sep 29 23:33:51 2004:WBGirl
[0/] Msg:Same here with not being able to have a conversation or
phone call ~ I have started teaching Alice it's not polite to
interrupt and to say Excuse Me - it doesn't work all the time though
Wed Sep 29 23:34:07 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Whoops! Typo. The word should be "meaningful" not meaninful.
Wed Sep 29 23:34:28 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah i don't want her to think she rules the roost but i do
also want her to feel appreciated
Wed Sep 29 23:34:45 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Does she have jobs that she does to contribute to the
household?
Wed Sep 29 23:34:51 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its hard to find the right balance...i'm always afraid i'm
giving in too much and then i'm afraid i don't give enough!
Wed Sep 29 23:35:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:nothing on a regular basis...i do have her help
sometimes...she likes to feed the cats
Wed Sep 29 23:35:44 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i have had her put away silverware and help put away dishes
and clear the table...but its usually just here and there
Wed Sep 29 23:36:07 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:She is old enough to have a few jobs and it may be just the
thing to help her feel more capable.
Wed Sep 29 23:36:13 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she does like it if she's in a good mood...but if she's in
a foul mood and i ask her to help she won't do a thing
Wed Sep 29 23:36:34 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Does it feel like the two of you are in a power struggle?
Wed Sep 29 23:36:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:then it becomes a battle and that's something i'm really
weary of these days
Wed Sep 29 23:36:43 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh heck ya
Wed Sep 29 23:36:45 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:daily
Wed Sep 29 23:37:12 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tell me about your first encounter with her in the morning?
How does it usually go?
Wed Sep 29 23:37:17 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:all day every day it feels like sometimes...although i
refuse to really bonk heads with her...i do let her know i'm not
going to fight her and that this is just how it is...when
appropriate...
Wed Sep 29 23:37:26 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh lordy....it depends on the day
Wed Sep 29 23:38:10 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i am on the computer in the morning....and when she calls
me she expects me to drop everything...which sometimes i do...but if
i'm in the middle of something i will tell her "i'll be right there"
Wed Sep 29 23:38:22 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Is she calling you from her bed?
Wed Sep 29 23:38:28 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and then keep talking to her...sing a song ....ask her
questions....
Wed Sep 29 23:38:32 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:from our family bed
Wed Sep 29 23:38:35 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:in the other room
Wed Sep 29 23:38:47 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and i try to go asap so she's not annoyed waiting for me
Wed Sep 29 23:38:55 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but its not always quick enough for her
Wed Sep 29 23:39:11 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Okay. I'm going to ask a question that may seem simple
--may seem silly.
Wed Sep 29 23:39:32 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Is she physically able to get out of the bed and walk to
you?
Wed Sep 29 23:39:38 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes and she used to do that
Wed Sep 29 23:39:49 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she used to just get up and come in to me and climb into my
lap
Wed Sep 29 23:39:52 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:What happened?
Wed Sep 29 23:40:05 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:ummm...her brother died?
Wed Sep 29 23:40:18 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:actually i'm not sure if that's when it happened, i'm
guessing
Wed Sep 29 23:40:26 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:So you started going to her first? Or she started calling
you first?
Wed Sep 29 23:41:38 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she calls me then i go in to her and on good days we lay in
bed and sing songs and play "where's maeven?" and just talk and
snuggle and tickle
Wed Sep 29 23:41:50 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:on bad days, she finds things to whine about and cry
Wed Sep 29 23:42:11 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:But you always go to her in the bed?
Wed Sep 29 23:42:28 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes because she freaks out if i don't
Wed Sep 29 23:42:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its a battle i decided i don't want to fight
Wed Sep 29 23:42:50 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Ah. Okay.. Is this arrangement okay with you or would you
like to do something different?
Wed Sep 29 23:43:11 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i'm ok with going in to her....that doesn't bother me
Wed Sep 29 23:43:36 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i would prefer she came to me, but i know she will again
when she's ready...she's become EXTREMELY fearful since her brother
died
Wed Sep 29 23:43:38 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Would you be comfortable with walking back out of the room
when she is rude?
Wed Sep 29 23:43:44 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh yes, and i do
Wed Sep 29 23:43:57 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tina, have you seen a grief counselor?
Wed Sep 29 23:44:16 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes and we go to couples group for infant loss
Wed Sep 29 23:44:26 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Is that going well?
Wed Sep 29 23:45:00 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I mean as well as can be expected.
Wed Sep 29 23:45:08 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes
Wed Sep 29 23:45:11 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i think so
Wed Sep 29 23:45:38 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:maeven has always been demanding and i don't know that she
wouldn't be like this regardless of our loss....she's just always
been very high needs....
Wed Sep 29 23:45:44 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Are you familiar with the book series, "Your One Year Old",
'Your Two Year Old", etc.?
Wed Sep 29 23:45:53 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its the recent rudeness and mood swings from hell that are
causing me to lose my mind
Wed Sep 29 23:46:01 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes
Wed Sep 29 23:46:03 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:You may want to read "Your Four Year Old".
Wed Sep 29 23:46:26 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes i think i will...i'm told this behavior is typical of
this age???
Wed Sep 29 23:46:31 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lord help me, lol
Wed Sep 29 23:46:32 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:It discusses the fours and the "fearsome fours" and she may
be processing those fears a bit early since she had to deal with a
pretty big fear.
Wed Sep 29 23:47:01 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i'm listening to her be mouthy to my husband right
now....what causes them to be mouthy like that?
Wed Sep 29 23:47:10 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:its the tone, not the words so much
Wed Sep 29 23:47:17 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:One idea is for you to create a new ritual for the two of
you to feel close in the mornings.
Wed Sep 29 23:48:23 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes i need to do that
Wed Sep 29 23:48:44 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Another idea is to "Decide what YOU will do , not what the
child will do" meaning that it's so much easier to control our own
actions and how we will respond to a situation than to try to
control the child's response.
Wed Sep 29 23:49:22 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:You can't "make" her stop screaming and whining and being
rude, but you CAN decide how you will react and how you will show
respect for yourself by how you react.
Wed Sep 29 23:49:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh you know what, i've heard you say that before and i'd
forgotten...that totally applies for rudeness, doesn't it?
Wed Sep 29 23:49:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh that's a lightbulb moment
Wed Sep 29 23:49:54 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:And then there's always trying the unexpected hug!
Wed Sep 29 23:50:18 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah sometimes that works, sometimes she pushes me away
Wed Sep 29 23:50:30 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:being silly with her often works, but not always
Wed Sep 29 23:50:42 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I'm wondering is that 4 yo. book is the one that said
something to the effect, "Four year olds can be such a pain. Send
them to a good preschool for a few hours a day to give yourself a
break to keep your sanity."
Wed Sep 29 23:50:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:thanks kelly...sorry i monopolized the chat, guys!!!
Wed Sep 29 23:50:57 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I swear one of those "year" books says something to that
effect.
Wed Sep 29 23:51:05 2004:WBGirl
[0/] Msg:I'm sure one of them does say that! LOL
Wed Sep 29 23:51:15 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:you know, a year ago i would have totally thought that was
wrong....today.....i'm thinking i need something like that!
Wed Sep 29 23:51:49 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:tamy has a question (toothfairy)
Wed Sep 29 23:51:52 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Another idea is to swap play dates/babysitting with a
friend so you get a break once a week and she gets a break once a
week.
Wed Sep 29 23:52:00 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Hi Tamy
Wed Sep 29 23:52:03 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Hi again, I was just wondering if you could suggest your
favorite books for those of us breaking into positive discipline. I
have Dr. Sears discipline book, but what are your favorites? I have
a very strong willed 2 1/2 yr old dd and a 6 month old dd.
Wed Sep 29 23:52:07 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:actually my mom comes 3 days a week for a few hours
Wed Sep 29 23:52:16 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Oh, that's right, you're Toothfairy. :)
Wed Sep 29 23:53:22 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I REALLY like Jane Nelsen's first book Positive Discipline
but some people think it's a difficult read. Also there IS a part in
there that is not AP. Jane isn't a big believer in co-sleeping, but
you can just ignore that part.
Wed Sep 29 23:53:40 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:That book explains all of the concepts of Positive
Discipline.
Wed Sep 29 23:54:20 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:take what ya like and leave the rest :) true of everything,
ain't it? lol
Wed Sep 29 23:54:39 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Also I like the book "The Five Love Languages of Children"
by Gary Chapman and someone else. There are a few parts that I'd
remove from this one myself.
Wed Sep 29 23:54:47 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh gosh that one is GOOD!!
Wed Sep 29 23:54:54 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but it doesn't apply til they are 5
Wed Sep 29 23:55:10 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but good to read anyway...applies to adults as well
Wed Sep 29 23:55:16 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I have been checking out her site while chatting here and I
know that we have power struggles.
Wed Sep 29 23:55:17 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Punishment IS mentioned briefly in this book and I just
ignored that part. Also this book has a few references to the Bible
so don't read this one if that will bother you.
Wed Sep 29 23:56:19 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:how to talk so you kid will listen and listen so your kid
will talk...that's a good one too
Wed Sep 29 23:56:20 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I like Dr. Becky Bailey's audio tapes and CDs better than I
like her books.
Wed Sep 29 23:56:32 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Her website is
www.beckybailey.com
Wed Sep 29 23:56:33 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:never heard of her!
Wed Sep 29 23:57:19 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Our local parenting center has her tapes and audio CDs in
their parent lending library so parents around here can check them
out for free. You may want to see if your public library will buy
some of them.
Wed Sep 29 23:57:27 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh here's an awesome one i just learned about recently....
playful parenting by dr larry cohen...and he was here for a chat a
few months ago and there are transcripts
Wed Sep 29 23:57:45 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I keep hearing good things about Playful Parenting though I
haven't yet read it.
Wed Sep 29 23:57:59 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh i haven't finished it yet, but its really AWESOME
Wed Sep 29 23:58:09 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:She is not a child whom I can let walk beside me in the
store for instance, she laughs as she runs away.
Wed Sep 29 23:58:19 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Jane Nelsen has the book "Positive Discipline the First
Three Years" and "Positive Discipline for Preschoolers"
Wed Sep 29 23:58:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:he talks about how he feels that most discipline issues are
the result of disconnection
Wed Sep 29 23:58:56 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I only shopped at stores with carts for a while when my
kids were young.
Wed Sep 29 23:59:05 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and just being silly can solve just about everything
Wed Sep 29 23:59:15 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but i just don't always feel like being silly,
unfortunately
Wed Sep 29 23:59:20 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:That DOES sound good Tina!
Wed Sep 29 23:59:35 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yes he has lots of examples of games
Wed Sep 29 23:59:51 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Exactly. We all have our own emotions and issues to deal
with and laundry to get done and food to buy and cook, etc.
Thu Sep 30 00:00:04 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:really great...check out the transcripts and you get a
taste of what he's about...there are some insights in his book i
just never thought of!
Thu Sep 30 00:00:20 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:How about Jane Nelson's A-Z book? Is that more of a
reference book?
Thu Sep 30 00:00:22 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:In my classes, I also discuss about how to take care of
yourself as a parent.
Thu Sep 30 00:00:45 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but i tell ya...of all the techniques and ideas that i have
tried....larry's is the easiest to implement and it works the best
for my particular child
Thu Sep 30 00:00:49 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she really responds to goofy
Thu Sep 30 00:00:51 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lol
Thu Sep 30 00:00:59 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Yes, the A-Z book is a reference book, but a good one. You
can look up issues such as "biting" or "food issues" and get a few
different ideas and thoughts.
Thu Sep 30 00:01:11 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and he is right in line with jane as well, kelly...they
would get along well
Thu Sep 30 00:01:37 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah i like a-z when i can find my issue in it....but it
doesn't have all my issues, lol
Thu Sep 30 00:01:41 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Wow!! Maybe they will get to meet at a conference. I wonder
if he will attend the NAEYC Conference this year. Jane will be
there.
Thu Sep 30 00:02:08 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh i wouldn't doubt it...he does la leche league
conferences, from what i hear....and la leche league is promoting
him these days
Thu Sep 30 00:02:15 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and attachment parenting international as well
Thu Sep 30 00:02:39 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:he has some interesting things to say about CIO (crying it
out) in the chat transcript
Thu Sep 30 00:03:09 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:One of Jane's/ Adler's principles that really works well at
our house is to give kids meaningful jobs. When my kids are really
getting surly, we just find a project to accomplish together.
Thu Sep 30 00:03:23 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah you know he's like a different look at the things that
jane talks about...extending the "be silly" advice that jane gives
and really focusing on it....
Thu Sep 30 00:03:51 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:ok, how can I get across to my oldest that she cannot roll
on top of her little sister? She loves her sis, but she is dangerous
with her! Especially with scary hugs around the neck.
Thu Sep 30 00:04:02 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah that's a great idea...works here too...if i have the
energy and attitude to think about it, lol
Thu Sep 30 00:04:06 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Well, being silly sure got me through some days when I felt
like pitching my kids out of the front window!
Thu Sep 30 00:04:20 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yup
Thu Sep 30 00:04:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh tamy, you should read last month's positive discipline
chat...i think marisa had the same issue, as i recall
Thu Sep 30 00:04:41 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tell me their ages again Tami.
Thu Sep 30 00:04:52 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:2 1/2 yrs and six months
Thu Sep 30 00:05:01 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:about the same ages as marisa's too
Thu Sep 30 00:05:18 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:remember elijah and hugging his sister too much?
Thu Sep 30 00:05:25 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I'm going to read that
Thu Sep 30 00:05:28 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:marisa asked larry cohen about this as well
Thu Sep 30 00:05:29 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Oh, this is SOOOOOOO hard. It practically requires 24/7
supervision when you have a 2 yo. and a baby.
Thu Sep 30 00:05:44 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:so its in the playful parenting chat transcript as well
Thu Sep 30 00:05:50 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:The 2 yo. really doesn't have a true concept of how they
could hurt the baby.
Thu Sep 30 00:06:08 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah that's more something that they grow out of, isn't it?
Thu Sep 30 00:06:11 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I think I have started to get across to her that she can
"break" the baby. I just wondered if you had any other ideas.
Thu Sep 30 00:06:38 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I do have one. Teach her ways that she can interact with
the baby --ways that are safe for everyone.
Thu Sep 30 00:07:03 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Thihgs like singing songs to her, doing finger plays with
her, reading (pretend) her a book, telling her a story, etc.
Thu Sep 30 00:07:15 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I try to...I ask her to play peek a boo with her instead.
Thu Sep 30 00:07:19 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i just peeked at the last pd transcript and that issue is
the first one there
Thu Sep 30 00:07:28 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I will read it also, thanks.
Thu Sep 30 00:07:30 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Oh? What did I say?
Thu Sep 30 00:07:48 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tihs really requires constant supervision and is very, very
tiring.
Thu Sep 30 00:07:59 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:It scares me.
Thu Sep 30 00:08:11 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I'm wondering if she is actually trying to get your
attention.
Thu Sep 30 00:08:13 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lol
Thu Sep 30 00:08:19 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:you explored the 4 mistaken goals
Thu Sep 30 00:08:28 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:It's a possibility
Thu Sep 30 00:08:34 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and you said you thought it was undue attention
Thu Sep 30 00:09:05 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Do you have some rituals that you do with her? Times that
you read her a book before bedtime or do fingerplays with her, etc.?
Thu Sep 30 00:09:43 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:A couple. We eat lunch together at the table and I always
lay down with her at night
Thu Sep 30 00:09:44 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:It's hard for a child to get used to a sibling. The new
sibilng requires SO much attention that used to be directed to the
older child.
Thu Sep 30 00:10:09 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh and you said that she should do for the baby what she
can't do and scoop the baby up and ignore the older child (when
they're not listening)
Thu Sep 30 00:10:13 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:You may want to try to work in a few more rituals
throughout the day --to give her a little more one on one time with
you.
Thu Sep 30 00:10:27 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Oh, yes. I remember that now.
Thu Sep 30 00:10:30 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg::)
Thu Sep 30 00:10:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lemme see what larry said...marisa asked him the same
thing...
Thu Sep 30 00:10:48 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I'd love to know what he said.
Thu Sep 30 00:10:52 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I have been telling myself I need to do that.
Thu Sep 30 00:11:02 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and as i recall they were all good suggestions
Thu Sep 30 00:11:36 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Are the 4 mistaken goals discussed in the books you
mentioned?
Thu Sep 30 00:12:16 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:The mistaken goals are in the first book called Positive
Discipline. I'm not sure if they are in the book about the first
three years.
Thu Sep 30 00:12:38 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I'm pulling my preschoolers one off the shelf to look
Thu Sep 30 00:13:07 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh tamy, i won't say it all over again here, but larry has
a game called baby in hot lava...you just need to read the playful
parenting transcript...about a third of the waythrough
Thu Sep 30 00:13:15 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Yes, they are in the book called 'PD for Preschoolers"
Thu Sep 30 00:13:39 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Well, now you've got me really interested in Larry's book!
Thu Sep 30 00:13:44 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lol
Thu Sep 30 00:13:55 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:It sounds similar to Becky Bailey's "Love Rituals"
Thu Sep 30 00:13:59 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well i'm not discounting jane, though...cuz i LOVE her
stuff too! its all good!
Thu Sep 30 00:14:19 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:She has lots of games and rituals that are meant to connect
parents to kids, kids to kids, teachers to kids.
Thu Sep 30 00:14:23 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:what you are saying, kelly, is great too of course...nice
to pull all this stuff together
Thu Sep 30 00:14:34 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:yeah that's the same kind of thing larry does too
Thu Sep 30 00:14:39 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Oh, I use lots of different resources.
Thu Sep 30 00:14:55 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I am making myself a note to check out the past
transcripts, Thanks so much ladies! I have been wondering lately if
I need anger management, but I think I need positive discipline
management.
Thu Sep 30 00:15:21 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lol, me too!
Thu Sep 30 00:15:32 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Tami, are you doing anything for yourself. I always say
that one of the most important aspects of parenting is SELF CARE!!
Thu Sep 30 00:15:42 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i've been at whits end lately...she pushes my buttons like
you wouldn't believe...and then i end up feeling so guilty of course
Thu Sep 30 00:16:20 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I think I am....I am successfully losing weight and
exercising (with the kids of course).
Thu Sep 30 00:16:26 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i am starting to feel like the time i am making her have
with her nana is actually making things worse
Thu Sep 30 00:16:27 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Yes, I've had to work on DISconnecting my buttons. It has
taken a while to get them all disconnected, but I have made alot of
progess. Work on one at a time.
Thu Sep 30 00:16:43 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and how DOES one disconnect those buttons???
Thu Sep 30 00:17:04 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I need my buttons disconnected too! lol
Thu Sep 30 00:17:08 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:The book "Giving the Love that Heals" was very helpful for
me.
Thu Sep 30 00:17:32 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well i have someone that wants to teach me to meditate...i
do need that...if i can just find the time!
Thu Sep 30 00:17:37 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Also talking with my husband about WHY things bother me. It
usually has to do with my childhood or my own interpretations of how
the world "should" work.
Thu Sep 30 00:17:52 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:hmmm...maybe so
Thu Sep 30 00:17:59 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:my mom had no patience
Thu Sep 30 00:18:02 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Also I had to adopt the true belief that "mistakes are
wonderful opportunities to learn." Embrace imperfect!
Thu Sep 30 00:18:21 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:This one took me quite a while!
Thu Sep 30 00:18:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:she has immense patience for my dd...but just today i saw
that patience cracking
Thu Sep 30 00:18:47 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I had to become comfortable with my own imperfections in
order to be able to deal with the imperfections of my children.
Thu Sep 30 00:19:02 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:hmmm...that's a thought
Thu Sep 30 00:19:14 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I think part of my problem is from my oldest's first six
months. I was poorly directed to read the book "Babywise". We're
still not completely connected.
Thu Sep 30 00:19:30 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I was supposed to be typing "Embrace imperfection" above.
I'm tired. it's midnight here.
Thu Sep 30 00:19:36 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:oh bummer!
Thu Sep 30 00:19:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:that's a bad bad book
Thu Sep 30 00:19:43 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg::(
Thu Sep 30 00:19:46 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I hate that man
Thu Sep 30 00:19:51 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i hear ya
Thu Sep 30 00:20:18 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well we need to wrap this up...i'm sorry, kelly, i really
meant to try to keep it to an hour tonite!
Thu Sep 30 00:20:20 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Yeah, I hide those books in the bookstores.
Thu Sep 30 00:20:29 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:lol, me too
Thu Sep 30 00:20:31 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:LOL
Thu Sep 30 00:20:33 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but there's so many!
Thu Sep 30 00:20:42 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:I threw mine away for sure
Thu Sep 30 00:20:49 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:It's fine. It helps me in my own parenting when I answer
questions for others.
Thu Sep 30 00:21:03 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well i have a ton more....lol
Thu Sep 30 00:21:11 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:but i will not monopolize anymore, lol
Thu Sep 30 00:21:21 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:i just have been super overwhelmed lately
Thu Sep 30 00:21:23 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I will check with the others about being the guest/host
next time.
Thu Sep 30 00:21:29 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Me too, but we all need sleep too to deal with these button
pushers
Thu Sep 30 00:21:35 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Cut yourself some slack.
Thu Sep 30 00:21:47 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and trying to get pregnant again just 5 months after my son
died at birth has a lot to do with it i'm sure
Thu Sep 30 00:22:05 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:Wow!! Your hormones are still probably not quite back to
normal yet!
Thu Sep 30 00:22:07 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Pardon me..... any books come to mind about REconnecting?
Thu Sep 30 00:22:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:well playful parenting is all about connection
Thu Sep 30 00:22:40 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:and he even talks about mending relationships
Thu Sep 30 00:23:02 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:there's a link to the book on the transcripts page
Thu Sep 30 00:23:10 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:I've got to cut out moms.
Thu Sep 30 00:23:16 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:ok see ya!
Thu Sep 30 00:23:19 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Thank you both so much! Good night!
Thu Sep 30 00:23:24 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:thanks a bunch kelly!
Thu Sep 30 00:23:24 2004:PDMod_Kelly
[0/] Msg:night!
Thu Sep 30 00:23:41 2004:Webmama_Tina
[0/] Msg:night night tamy!
Thu Sep 30 00:23:49 2004:Toothfairy
[0/] Msg:Nite, thanks!
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